Depth Chart and the Second Team

by Dave Clark on Jul 30, 2010 1:00 PM PDT in Sounders: MLS Regular Season

One of the notable things from Jeremiah's post earlier today is that the Sounders are likely to trade or waive a player soon. In light of that let's look at how the current depth chart looks, and then we'll look at how an ideal First Team and Second Team could be run out in League play at full health.

As I've done before on this website, I'm going to list the top four players in each role of Sigi's system. With Ljungberg's status quite uncertain I'm going to leave him out for now.

Target Forward - Blaise Nkufo, Nate Jaqua, Pat Noonan, Mike Fucito
Withdrawn Forward - Fredy Montero, Roger Levesque, David Estrada, Miguel Montano
Left Wing - Steve Zakuani, Fucito, Sanna Nyassi, Montano
Right Wing - Montano, Nyassi, Estrada, Levesque
Center Mid - Alvaro Fernandez, Brad Evans, Michael Seamon, Osvaldo Alonso
Defensive Mid - Alonso, Patrick Ianni, Peter Vagenas, Sturgis
Left Back - Leo Gonzalez, Tyson Wahl, Zach Scott, Patrick Ianni
Centerback - Jhon Kennedy Hurtado, Jeff Parke, Ianni, Tyronne Marshall, Taylor Graham
Right Back - Riley, Scott, Wahl, Evans
Keeper - Kasey Keller, Terry Boss

Another way to look at this would be to look at the squad as a First Team and a Second Team.

Since Hurtado is injured for a longer period of time I won't include him, but the more lightly injured players I will include, as the decision to cut or trade should be made based on the longterm state of the club.

		First Team
		Nkufo
			Montero
Zakuani		Fernandez		Montano

Gonzalez		Alonso		Riley
	Parke		Ianni
		Keller

		Second Team
		Jaqua
			Levesque
Fucito		Evans		Estrada

		Vagenas
Wahl	Marshall		Graham	Scott
		Boss

Extras:	Sturgis	Noonan	Nyassi	Seamon
Unknown:	Ljungberg
Injured:	Hurtado

This should give you an image of who may be on the cut list, if that's the direction the team chooses to go. But what else we see is that the Second Team, particularly up the spine, has several players who are capable MLS starters, some of whom may have trade value.

In the past few weeks the team has bumped Tyrone Marshall, Nate Jaqua and Brad Evans to non-starting roles. The health of the team has pushed players like Nate Sturgis, Peter Vagenas and Pat Noonan into roles of depth.

While some could quibble about who is placed where, the fact is that a healthy team of Rave Green is quite talented, and in recent weeks, quite good. It is a team that is positioned to move a talent or two via trade, and this time hopefully they do it for some allocation dollars, or a first-round pick.

Adrian has some options, but the League also knows that Seattle needs the roster space.

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Comments

Wow, if healthy, our first team is stacked.

However, looking at our second team, it looks like we should be focusing on acquiring youth and talent for the back line.

Karma police, arrest this man.

by wyte_lightning on Jul 30, 2010 1:13 PM PDT reply actions

Especially at the RB/LB positions. There’s some good depth at the Center Back position. However, there’s a big drop-off after Riley and Leo at the RB/LB positions.

by Dizzo on Jul 30, 2010 1:16 PM PDT reply actions

Defense looks shakey on the second team

Quick question sorta related to that – When Hurtado’s back, who gets bumped?

by chrisperry1983 on Jul 30, 2010 1:18 PM PDT reply actions

That's a great question

Parke and Ianni have really been an outstanding duo, especially once Alonso came back. I honestly have no insight into who’s the No. 1 right now.

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by Jeremiah Oshan on Jul 30, 2010 1:23 PM PDT up reply actions

Bump Riley?

Or is he cemented in the right back position?

Karma police, arrest this man.

by wyte_lightning on Jul 30, 2010 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions

He's

pretty cemented in the RB right now imo.

by gstommylee on Jul 30, 2010 1:30 PM PDT up reply actions

Would it make sense to move Ianni to RB and put Hurtado back in one of the middle positions?

by chrisperry1983 on Jul 30, 2010 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions

I wouldn't mind.

Karma police, arrest this man.

by wyte_lightning on Jul 30, 2010 2:22 PM PDT up reply actions

In Sigi's system,

The RB and LB have to come forward and support the offense. I don’t think Ianni has shown enough as threat to play that style.

by blakec on Jul 30, 2010 3:08 PM PDT up reply actions

Nyassi

I wonder if Nyassi will ever be perceived as more valuable than he is now, and he seems quite expendable from a Sounders perspective. I would think an MLS squad needing speed would part with some back-line talent in exchange for a speedy winger.

by jordanR on Jul 30, 2010 1:21 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs

Nyassi, Sturgis and Evans

Would seem to me to be the ones that the Sounders should look to deal. They all likely have more value to another team than this one.

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by Dave Clark on Jul 30, 2010 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions

I agree

I think all three have a lot of value to another potential team. Evans in particular can fill multiple roles and his USMNT experience is a good selling point. He also takes the most out of Seattle’s cap ($110,000 a year in base salary).

Evans is also a favorite of Sigi and the two have a long history. I think Sigi would rather move Nyassi and keep the flexibility and experience that Evans provides.

by Dizzo on Jul 30, 2010 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions

I disagree with a few of these picks:

Too high:

- Estrada
- Montano
- Fucito

Too low:

- Mike Seamon
- Sanna Nyassi

I’m not sure where you’re getting Estrada over Nyassi. Sanna, despite his ability to put shots on frame, has been one of Seattle’s most dangerous players in the final third the last few weeks. I know this is partially due to Jaqua, Evans and Alonso returning to health, but still—I think Sigi is at least confident enough to put him on the second team.

I don’t get the Fucito pick. The guy had a wondergoal but has hardly been a consistent performer. He’s only been healthy enough to have a cup of coffee with the team.

I think Miguel Montano is still a stretch of matches away from being a lock in the starting lineup. He’s tricky, but seems to suffer from some of the same consistency issues that has plagued Montero and Zakuani (moreso last year with the latter player).

Where’s Mike Seamon? Sigi has called his number a decent amount in the last few weeks.

Pitch me on Estrada. Granted, he’s been hurt, but I haven’t see much of him aside from that Boca Juniors friendly. I see him more in the ‘extras’ category.

by Samuelson on Jul 30, 2010 1:35 PM PDT reply actions

I think

Dave left off Seamon by mistake.

by agtk on Jul 30, 2010 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions

But he isn't going to beat out Fernandez, nor Evans

Think about that.

He’s capable of being a starting CM and he’s the 3rd best on this team.

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by Dave Clark on Jul 30, 2010 1:42 PM PDT up reply actions

I see

Alonso as who you listed as 3rd best CM. You didn’t mention Seamon anywhere.

I don’t dispute that Evans and Fernandez are probably better, but I see promise in Seamon’s development in the middle.

by agtk on Jul 30, 2010 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions

Seamon

will get playing time while evans is still recovering from his injury.

by gstommylee on Jul 30, 2010 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions

I overlooked him in the Depth portion

He’s been added.

Good catch, and its good to see you posting again.

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by Dave Clark on Jul 30, 2010 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions

I will have more time to post once my summer job ends and I am back to school

I think our best options are:

Sell FL10 while we can get something for him,

Trade Noonan or Nyassi, who both might actually be upgrades elsewhere,

or waive Sturgis. He is decent and young, but does not look like he has a very high ceiling. If possible, it would be nice to keep him around and have him fill holes at a later date though.

by agtk on Jul 30, 2010 2:05 PM PDT up reply actions

I don't think Seamon is THAT good.

by Samuelson on Jul 30, 2010 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions

Also

Even if Sounders don’t make the playoffs this year, if they make the group stage I think Adrian and Sigi will get to see a lot of the younger guys and how they fit. It’ll give them a lot of data to work with when they pick their expansion holds and decide who to move forward with (specifically thinking about Montano and Estrada).

by Samuelson on Jul 30, 2010 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions

read:

“Sanna’s INability to put shots on frame”

by Samuelson on Jul 30, 2010 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions

Evans?

What about pairing Alonso up with Evans in midfield, while pushing Alvaro out wide right?

I’m not sure how fast Alvaro, but I’m more of a fan of the two-way play of Evans compared to the fancy dribbling of Montano. I just don’t think Montano is ready at all yet for significant 1st team action. He reminds me of a young youth player who is really good at dribbling. Trying to take 5 people on works at the youth level, but not at this level. He should be used more as an offensive reserve to give us a spark in games late (ala Nyassi)

by MMAWrestling on Jul 30, 2010 1:35 PM PDT reply actions

couple reasons

we have plently of depth at RW as it is. Second Evans is still recovering from his injury and will have work his way back to being fit again to start.

by gstommylee on Jul 30, 2010 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions

Yes

But I was basing on the info above, when you are including the injured players in the lineup options.

by MMAWrestling on Jul 30, 2010 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions

Seamon?

Where does Seamon fit in this picture?

by Jeff Wampler on Jul 30, 2010 1:35 PM PDT reply actions

No Ianni at defensive mid?

Back in May you were saying Ianni would be a starter at CDM for half the teams in MLS. Have you changed you mind, or just an oversight?

by 108Ultra on Jul 30, 2010 1:39 PM PDT reply actions

Ianni was at

CDM while Alonso and PV were out.

by gstommylee on Jul 30, 2010 1:45 PM PDT up reply actions

Oversight, I would put him at #2 in the depth by position

And will be adding that now

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by Dave Clark on Jul 30, 2010 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions

Four in each position is a stretch

I don’t know if going four deep at each spot of the Sigi system is a good idea. It clearly puts some players in spots that really don’t fit. In which case, it hides some areas where the Sounders are thin and overshadows the value of guys like Levesque and Evans who can play multiple spots well.

For conversation’s sake, here’s what I think the chart might look like with everyone in a position I think they’ve shown they can play reasonably well in and with only one starter in each position:

Target Forward – Blaise Nkufo, Nate Jaqua
Withdrawn Forward – Fredy Montero, Roger Levesque, David Estrada, Mike Fucito, Brad Evans
Left Wing – Steve Zakuani, Sanna Nyassi, Roger Levesque, Brad Evans
Right Wing – Montano, Nyassi, Levesque, Brad Evans
Center Mid – Alvaro Fernandez, Brad Evans, Mike Seamon, Nate Sturgis
Defensive Mid – Alonso, Peter Vagenas, Sturgis, Patrick Ianni
Left Back – Leo Gonzalez, Tyson Wahl, Zach Scott
Centerback1 – Jhon Kennedy Hurtado, Ianni, Taylor Graham, Tyson Wahl
Centerback2 – Jeff Parke, Ianni, Tyronne Marshall, Taylor Graham, Tyson Wahl
Right Back – Riley, Scott, Wahl
Keeper – Kasey Keller, Terry Boss

Looking at the list we seem heavy on young players that can fill the withdrawn forward spot, but less so with big, target forward types. We have a strong midfield and center backs, but need some young talent at the RB/LB positions.

by Dizzo on Jul 30, 2010 1:49 PM PDT reply actions

I actually am very certain that Fucito can be a target forward

while he’s short

His frame has filled out, he has the leaping ability to win balls, has good vision to hit running teammates, and can score. He has been used in this role in practices when healthy.

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Sounder At Heart

by Dave Clark on Jul 30, 2010 1:55 PM PDT up reply actions

I’m glad to hear he can play up at the target forward spot. It’s a real shame about the knee injury. I think everyone was excited to see him play more at the start of the year. We certainly could have used him as a target forward.

by Dizzo on Jul 30, 2010 2:14 PM PDT up reply actions

Does this team necessarily need a target man?

I don’t doubt that having a Jacqua or Nkufo makes us better, but I don’t think it’s the end of the world if we start Montero and Levesque at some point down the line if injuries bite us. Certainly starting with two technical forwards is a lot less damaging than starting two CAMs or three wingers.

by Tohoya on Jul 30, 2010 2:14 PM PDT up reply actions

I would agree in most other leagues, but the MLS is just to physical. We really need someone up front to bang on the opposing team’s center-backs and give some room for Montero to work.

I used to be Jaqua hater, but with his large absence this year, it’s clear that the team needs someone to fill that target forward role.

by Dizzo on Jul 30, 2010 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions

did you see how they played without jaqua and nkufo?

by murmur000 on Jul 30, 2010 3:07 PM PDT up reply actions

The thing that I'm worried about is...

The Expansion Draft. I’m sure that PDX and Vancouver will be keen to draft players away from their rival. We might lose some depth or some of those trading chips. Do we protect all of those starting 11 with the exceptions of Hurtado for Ianni?

by lefthand on Jul 30, 2010 2:22 PM PDT reply actions

I suppose we didn’t protect Riley last year so I would assume he’ll be left dangling again this year. Maybe Seamon takes that place?

by lefthand on Jul 30, 2010 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions

too

early to tell who’s gonna be protected and who’s not especially nice we don’t know what the rules gonna be and how the expanded DP rules gonna take into account.

by gstommylee on Jul 30, 2010 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs