What we learned and where we go from here
As much as Bruce Arena would like you to believe that Wednesday's game was essentially a "reserve game" that "doesn't make sense," I'm not at all convinced that it was an insignificant victory for the Sounders.
At the very least, it assures that the Rave Green will be involved in a meaningful game late in the season (currently scheduled for Sept. 1 at Starfire against Chivas USA).
Of more consequence is the continued emergence of some of the Sounders who played vital roles in what really was a thorough dismantling of a team that is much better than Arena seems willing to admit.
Granted, the Galaxy didn't even bother to bring stars Landon Donovan and Edson Buddle on their trip. They also chose to sit some of the players who helped Los Angeles go 3-1-1 during Donovan and Buddle's World Cup absence -- most notably Tristan Bowen, Todd Dunivant, Michael Stephens and Donovan Ricketts.
Still, what Los Angeles was left with was a team of players with whom Arena had enough confidence to give 43 collective starts -- and the two players with the least number of starts, Eddie Lewis (one) and Clint Mathis (zero), are two of the most experienced players on the team. Their starters have accounted for seven goals, three assists and a shutout during MLS play.
The point being that while the Sounders may not have repaid the favor of Sunday's loss, they didn't exactly beat up on a bunch of neophytes, either.
On paper, at least, the Sounders looked like the team that should have been overmatched. Their starters in Wednesday's game had just 24 collective MLS starts this season and four have not started a game all year.
Three of those players without a start -- Nate Jaqua, Michael Seamon and Miguel Montano -- may, in fact, hold the key to salvaging this season.
I'm not necessarily suggesting that all three of them earned the right to become starters based on a couple U.S. Open Cup matches. I do think that they have earned the right to show what they can do against top-level competition, even if it's just in extended reserve minutes.
Let's take a look at them one at a time:
Nate Jaqua
What we already knew: A starter for most of last year, he was nevertheless one of the players many fans failed to appreciate despite being second on the team with nine goals and seven assists. His absence, due to an abdominal injury, seems to have made many grow fonder of a player who, while neither gifted with speed or great ball handling, has an obvious nose for the goal.
What we learned: Wednesday was a near perfect encapsulation of all of that. Jaqua provided an aerial presence the Sounders have been lacking all year, did an admirable job of winning 50/50 balls and holding possession and scored a pair of goals by winning physical battles. On the downside, he missed a couple open chances and didn't make much of an impression with his passing.
Where we go: Taken as a whole, it seems pretty obvious that he belongs among the starting XI if he's fit enough to play, at least until Blaise Nkufo arrives.
What Sigi had to say: "Obviously he can make a difference. He's a different type of forward than what we have. Our injuries for us this year for us have been right down the middle of the field with Nate and [Jhon] Kennedy [Hurtado] in the back and [Brad] Evans and [Osvaldo] Alonso in the middle of midfield and that's the heart of your team, the nucleus of your team. That's not where you want to have injuries. So obviously Nate being back, he's put in a lot of heart and soul in it. It's been tremendous."
Miguel Montano
What we already knew: The 18-year-old Colombian has some obvious flare. He has a potent right-footed shot. He has great dribbling skills, has above-average quickness and sees the field well. We also know that he's raw and is prone to hyper-activity that sometimes takes him out of the game.
What we learned: Given minutes, he settles down nicely. On several occasions, he even showed a nasty streak and refused to back down when play turned physical. He's also got some real speed to go along with that quickness, as he was repeatedly able to get behind his marks and created several good scoring opportunities.
Where we go: I'm not sure that I feel entirely comfortable starting him. For one, his most obvious starting position would be as an outside mid and I think Freddie Ljungberg and Steve Zakuani still need to be on the field. You could play him at central mid, but I would like to see him worked into a position like that first. One way or the other, though, I think minutes need to be found for him.
What Sigi said: "Tremendous. He was out of gas when he came out but really the first goal was his goal. It was his effort all the way through. Nate put it in, put it over the line, but the second goal was just a great cross to the back post for Nate and whipped it in. On top of that, we also got a really good defensive effort from him. He kept pressure on the Galaxy, offensively and defensively, and that's what you need form your wide guys."
Michael Seamon
What we already knew: Of all the players on the roster, the least may be known about the second-round pick out of Villanova. He is the player who was most recently signed, but has made the most of his time. He scored a goal in his first game -- in the friendly against Boca Juniors -- and has slowly worked his way into the 18. He's shown great vision, a good passing touch and a willingness to work track back on defense.
What we learned: I don't know that we really learned anything other than our initial impressions seem to be born out with more playing time.
Where we go: It might be a bit of a toss-up between him and Montano, but Seamon seems to be the more natural central midfielder. I think that gives him the edge in terms of breaking the starting XI first and would mind seeing his debut there this Sunday.
Going forward
The rash of injuries may at least partly explain the Sounders' struggles, but that doesn't mean much.
This team has to figure out a way to remain competitive while their injuries heal and the best way to do that, I think, is to stop expecting different results from the same personnel.
I think this lineup would give the Sounders their best chance for the time being:
| Jaqua | ||||
| Montero | ||||
| Zakuani | Seamon | Ljungberg | ||
| Riley | ||||
| Gonzalez | Parke | Ianni | Scott | |
| Keller |
By no means am I saying that this is the team that will get us to the playoffs. I do think that it has a reasonable shot of keeping us competitive, while also building toward the future.
Curious to hear what you guys would like to see moving forward.
0 recs |
23 comments
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Comments
I think it's worth trying,
and if Sigi is true to his word, we should see something like it.
But I would think that Scott and Gonzalez would be switched, and I doubt we’d see Riley at CDM, even though he got a taste yesterday. Maybe Seamon and Sturgis?
I’d much rather have Ianni than Marshall. And I definitely don’t need to see Wahl in there.
I wouldn’t mind something like this:
Jaqua
-——————————-Montero
Zakuani———Freddie———-Montano
-———————Seamon
Gonzalez—Parke—Ianni—Riley
Hasn’t Freddie said he prefers the middle? I seem to remember his saying that this year.
Zakuani always gets subbed out. So Nyassi. Sturgis for Freddie or Seamon.
We’ll see if Sigi really brings the hammer down, or just trots out the same old same old.
by Cornchops on Jul 8, 2010 2:29 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
there you go
I like that lineup. A lot. (Would love it if Alonso were available…his defensive cover and range would give FL a little more freedom).
I think Freddie’s comments were that he prefers facing the goal (midfield) versus having his back to goal and getting hacked down (as a withdrawn forward). Which is one of the nice things of having Jaqua back, trying to hack him down is kind of like trying to kick down a tree.
I like the idea of Ljungberg in the middle because he tends to get frustrated when playing the flank and ends up gravitating to the middle, anyway.
Anyone got the gonads to suggest Boss over Keller?
Boss over Keller?
While i’ll agree Keller has not been as perfect as he was last year He has still made some tremendous saves. And Boss doesn’t look anywhere near ready to control the box like Keller can. He still needs to work on his judgement on crosses and such.
This is based on
All the minutes we’ve seen Boss play?
by PeterJH on Jul 9, 2010 12:06 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
brilliant lineup
Montero is a great (MLS relatively) as a 2nd striker running off somebody and Jaqua is the best we have at holding the ball with back to the goal and an opportunist when giving the chance.
I love Ljundberg in the attacking mid-position but do worry about his defensive responsibilities. I think if we attack up the middle having Ianni step up when we’re on the offensive it will give Ljundberg even more freedom to roam about and create havoc for the other team….which we might be able to do if Jaqua can hold the ball a bit and allow us to shape up behind him. This would require our wingers of Montano and Zak to run their tails off, but this is one of the deepest parts of our team left.
And Seamon playing in the middle: he’s been offensively more creative than Vagenas and Sturgis I think.
http://web.me.com/lienc/Site/Sounders_Talk/Sounders_Talk.html
Take something from the world cup
The world cup has shown us many of the top teams have adopted the regular 4-3-3 into a 4-2-3-1 formation that i think would work well with the Sounders talents. It would work very well when Alonso and Evans get back as they are better defensively and distributing then our current central-mids but i think it could work. Something like
Jaqua———————-Zakuani——-Montero———Ljungberg
-——-Pete V———-Sturgis———
Gonzalez—Parke—-Ianni——Riley
I like the way Seamon has played but i don’t think he fits with the formation above, however if we stick with the formation we’ve been using though I’d put Seamon in as a central mid instead of Ianni, and move Ianni into the defense, and replace Noonan with Jaqua.
P.S. I wish i could find the article talking about the new popularity of the 4-2-3-1 and why it works but i can’t find it right now. I’ll try and post it later. I think it would be fantastic for our team once we get our best players back and healthy.
Found an Article, not the original one though
http://tomwfootball.wordpress.com/2010/07/07/world-cup-tactics-dont-neglect-the-holding-role/
This is a more recent look at the line-up in the world cup. In all honesty i think its better suited for when Alonso and Evans come back because they are two above average MLS holding Mids with good distribution. Perfect for this formation i think.
another one
http://tomwfootball.wordpress.com/2010/06/30/world-cup-tactics-how-the-quarter-finalists-line-up/
How is this different from when we played with a withdrawn forward?
by PeterJH on Jul 9, 2010 12:08 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Differance as I see it
The differance between this and the normal withdrawl forward formation we’ve seen from the team is the holding midfielders. What we’ve seen is Alonso in front of the backline. Then a midfield diamond. then a lone target striker. Looks like this.
-——--
-——-——
-—————-
-—————
-——-——
-—————-
I think this formation leave us too defensless against diagonal balls and makes the wide players have to take more defensive responsiblity then in nessesary. A 4-2-3-1 has two holding midfielders Essentailly in the same plane on of the field.
Right now Alonso, or whomever is in his role now that he is hurt is covering the entire space in front of the defense. With two midfielders there we should be able to pressure the other teams midfield better, while also allowing our wide players to share less defensive responsibility.
Wow that didn't work at all...
You should be able to find the general “Sigi’s Arrow” somewhere on this site. My formation didn’t format right above… weird
Here's the link you were probably thinking of
Graham broke down many formations, including the 4-2-3-1. Basically, the withdrawn forward formation we ran was more of a 4-1-3-2 or a 4-1-2-1-1. The 4-2-3-1 would be a change, as far as I know.
Here’s how it looks graphically:

Because if it's not Love | Then it's the bomb ... | That will bring us together
by Jeremiah Oshan on Jul 9, 2010 8:34 AM PDT up reply actions
Intriguing
I think I prefer Jeremiah’s lineup. Right now Montano strikes me as better suited as a high impact player coming off the bench to replace either Zakuani or Montero. I don’t think he has the experience or discipline yet to function well as a starter.
And I like the idea of Riley as a CDM tying together the defense and the offense – a notable gap this year. Certainly he has better speed than Vagenas and is arguably more offensively minded as well.
Experience and discipline
hasn’t helped much this year.
Yah I know
I’ve been a pretty severe critic of the team’s lack of energy so call me inconsistent :-)
But to me the bigger fundamental problem has been cohesion, ball movement and tying the back with the front. I’m not convinced that Montano will improve that. And I’m pretty sure that without improving here, nothing else will improve. No matter how good the front line is, it can’t do much if it it’s not being served
Two assists and
a shot-ricochet-tap-in for a goal seems like good service to me.
I’m not convinced, either, but I wouldn’t mind getting convinced on Sunday. I think the only way to do that is to start him.
I've been thinking about this A LOT
particularly after Sunday’s match, when Sigi trotted out the same broken lineup and yet another uninspiring performance ensued (moving Noonan and Ljungberg around and moving 2 or 3 guys 5 yards to switch from 4-2-3-1 to 4-3-3 does NOT constitute a change of any significance!!) It occurred to me at some point earlier in the week that perhaps Sigi trotted out that lineup knowing it was the less important of the week’s two matches, and was saving some of the players who played the marathon in P*ortland for the Wednesday game.
When thinking of what lineup we should use, I actually like to start with my ideal “best XI” and work backward. Essentially that means the usual back 4 with Ianni swapped in for Marshall, Evans and Alonso as holding central mids, Ljungberg and Zakuani as wide attacking mids, and NKufo and Jacqua as target forward and 2nd striker, respectively. Montero becomes the “closing striker” (a role epitomized by the NYRB away match) and, as I said yesterday, Vagenas, Noonan, and Marshall are relegated to “veteran reserves/rotationals”
Of course, that doesn’t answer who will play Sunday. Unfortunately, I’m not entirely sure Jacqua will be fit to start so soon, since I actually envision a 4-5-1/4-3-3 with him as the center forward (Montero on the aforementioned bench); with a CDM, two CM’s, and wingers forming a “V”-shape through midfield. However, without Jacqua, this would never work, since Montero is wholly incapable of operating as a lone striker. At any rate, our real problems exist in the fact that Evans and Alonso are out, which is why I’d like to see Seamon in the Evans role and Sturgis in the Alonso role if we run the usual 4-4-2/4-2-3-1.
If we really prefer Ljungberg in the middle, then the right is left open for any one of Montano, Nyassi, or even Seamon. The question I have about Ljungberg is if he is centrally located, is he the “Evans” CM or the withdrawn forward? I’d rather see him at withdrawn forward, which allows for two holding mids, but I also think its problematic to play Montero and Ljungberg together at forward.
At the end of the day, I am more or less resigned to the fact that out of injury and fitness necessity, as well as the fact that we have a League match next Thursday at DC United, we will probably see a lineup similar to last Sunday’s, and have to wait until the 15th to see something similar to what we’ve been discussing here.
...that's MISTER Keller to you!!!
This is all intersting conversation and it will be fun to see what Sigi actually does
Another thing that I would like to throw out there is Adrian has said in more than one interview that the Sounders are looking to bring in at least one more (maybe more) player (and this does not include Nkufo).
The players better start playing with that “It” factor or else some will not be on the team much longer.
I have not read a direct quote on that subject yet
Can you link us up, because I see reporters parsing words, but not the actual words.
They can always add a min. salary player, and they may have a smattering of allocation dollars left, and they could cut the USL guys or transfer Montero to get cap room.
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
In the post game yesterday
He was ask point blank by Arlo if they had any plans for the American transfer window.
Adrian replied that they did hope to bring in some players, but had no news to break at this time.
Just check the end of the game feed on soundersfc.com, they left in the entire post game interview with Arlo
Will do, of course
they could have a backloaded deal
I wouldn’t be surprised by that
Sign for 18 months with the first six being cut rate
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
Freddie may not be that bad an idea
I may hear it from some for suggesting so, but we could get a transfer fee and throughout his time here it has been a struggle to find a position on the field where he fits in with the rest of the team. Keep him, his contract is up at the end of the season, and we get nothing (other than some cap space).
by PeterJH on Jul 8, 2010 8:53 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I like it...
And I think it may allow Freddie Ljungberg to get more service as well. A few games this season you’ve seen FL kind of “go out of the game” when he’s out on the RM. He’s best out on the flank I think but the issue is that he hasn’t been getting the best service from the midfielders at that point. (With alonso being out and others in who just can’t do it, it doesn’t help.) Thus we’ve seen him float more into the middle where he definitely can play, but he’s not always as dangerous and gets hacked down a lot more there. So this is a good try I think and hopefully Sigi does something like this because a change is a must. The same lineup we’ve seen isn’t going to get different results.
by SounderEvertonRomaFan on Jul 10, 2010 10:03 AM PDT reply actions

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