Chicago Fire Game Reactions
by sidereal on Apr 9, 2011 4:22 PM PDT
in Sounders: MLS Regular Season
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Just some quick notes from my perspective at the half line. Gorgeous day for a game there.
- We can put to bed the O'Brian White question for a while - At this point even the doubters have to admit that he's a target forward that's worth starting. He has a different game than Jaqua but he wins as many balls as anyone we've played in that position over the years. And he's probably the best header of the ball we've ever had.
- Chicago is going to win a lot of games this year - You can see the way the ball flows through and around the team quickly and with intent. They're a good team and I think they'll be in the playoffs unless there's some kind of collapse.
- Alonso and Carrasco are a wrecking crew - I'm on record as not liking it when we play two holding midfielders regularly. I think it stifles our offense too much. But late in games when we're holding a lead, that's a pairing I like. It's sort of a van Bommel/de Jong pairing that makes midfielders anxious about dribbling through.
- Ref Hilario Grajeda did a great job. He had a good eye for really dangerous play without falling for any shenanigans. MLS needs more like him.
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Who starts when Montero gets healthy?
The offense was in full flight today and early in the San Jose game. I don’t think you can sit Montero, but who do you sit among the players out there on the pitch today?
Friberg
I’d put Rosales on the right wing and use Friberg as a midfield sub when we’re behind.
Nos Audietis
Why?
Evans looked great in the center today. His defense was good, his passing was solid, and he is making great runs. Because Rosales can’t go 90 minutes, and he will probably get used on the wing when Montero is healthy, I think it is best to keep Friberg as a sub for Rosales. And I think Evans has the edge in performance as a CM.
-Ben R.
I guess I don't see it
Evans is good, but he is the definition of an average player to me. Good at everything, but not great at anything in particular.
He may be better than Friberg at some things as far being a CM goes – particularly in the air – but Friberg’s creativity on the ball, speed, and his distribution (particularly with Rosales) makes me far prefer him as the starter. I love Evans as a sub precisely because he’s such a balanced player, but Friberg as a starter gives us a far more dynamic offense in my opinion.
by J Sep on Apr 9, 2011 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
I disagree
I can’t believe I’m saying this but I see the value in Evans. Look at who started yesterday. Rosales (or Montero), Zakuani, and White do not get back on D. This leaves, at most, 7 players in transition defense and Friberg (or Alvaro) is often caught outside in an extreme offensive position. We also know that Alonso tends to hang back in a more defensive position. That means that whoever is playing alongside Alonso needs to be three things: FIT, competent defensively, and able to make the late/weakside run. Evans does can do all three.
by TheTank123 on Apr 10, 2011 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
If you look at players as either attacking or defending
Seattle usually has 4 in attack and 5 in defense with the CM being the only one who is really trying to do both in an even amount.
Friberg, nor Alvaro have the defense and would shift Seattle to a 5/5. Carrasco makes that a 4/6.
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
I hate the term
but I really just think Evans is a “glue guy”. No one else can do what he does for 90 minutes.
Hey Dave
Definitely off-topic but I know that you’re reading, are you going to be able to make it down to the U18 MNT camp in Portland in a few weeks? I don’t see why you would since it has nothing to do with the Sounders, but I also know you’re one of the few bloggers in the PNW I know of that talk about youth stuff. They play the U of P and UW teams on Saturday the 23rd. Should be some good stuff.
Rosales to right wing
Friberg to center mid, Evans as a super sub.
by MicahRowe18 on Apr 9, 2011 4:59 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I have no problem with Evans but...
I really like the chemistry that Friberg and Rosales seem to have. Sigi talked earlier this week about how he wanted to play Friberg and Evans together and they could essentially interchange at times. Well, I actually think we saw interchanging and fluid movement between Friberg and Rosales… albeit a bit higher up the pitch.
When Montero returns, I’d be very curious to see a lineup that included Friberg and Rosales together… one wide and one in the middle but essentially interchanging like Sigi seemed to have imagined b/t Friberg and Evans.
Writer for SB Nation's Manchester United blog, 'The Busby Babe'
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"ROOOONEY!.... It defies description. How about spectacular?...How about superb?"
by Gene Um on Apr 9, 2011 5:26 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
It is interesting that the two games that Montero sits out, the Sounders score two goals in each game
However, I am not calling for him to sit when he is well.
What he brings
Is that ability to shoot from anywhere at anytime. Even Zakuani doesn’t scare teams while standing still, Montero definitely does.
I should be clear...
I don’t mean for Montero to sit. What I meant was that I’m intrigued at the possibility of this lineup: OBW at the target man, Montero withdrawn, Rosales on the right, Zak on the left, Ozzie holding, Friberg in the box-to-box role.
Flaco and Evans as versatile subs. Fucito and Jaqua used as subs when we need to chase goals. Carrasco used to help hold a lead like today.
Writer for SB Nation's Manchester United blog, 'The Busby Babe'
http://twitter.com/#!/Tui11BRoy3
"ROOOONEY!.... It defies description. How about spectacular?...How about superb?"
by Gene Um on Apr 9, 2011 5:35 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed
The best play I think I have seen from Friberg is in the middle. Rosales MUST stay in the lineup, the difference in play when he’s on the pitch is amazing.
Today Evans again was neither great nor terrible. I saw some good plays and bad ones from him. I like to call it “consistently inconsistent”
We could switch to a 3-4-3
Or some variation of that. Our back 4 hasnt been all that solid, so we can limit it to 3. I think Rosales’ good defense as a midfielder can partially make up for that.
Probably has no chance that Sigi will do this, but it would be fun to see something like this:
WhiteEvans—————————————————————
- Morales -———————————————————————————————— Friberg -
-—————————————————————Alonso—————————————————————
-——————————————————————————————————————————————-
-——————————————————————————————————————————————-
-———————-Hurtado————————-Parke————————Riley——————————-
-—————————————————————Keller——————————————————————
Dang that messed up my formation pretty badly
What I meant was White up real top
Zakuani and Montero behind him to make up the top 3
Morales Evans Friberg as midfield
Alonso right behind them to complete the midfield
Hurtado Parke Riley as defense
Keller
Totally agree
that it was a well reffed game. The gamethread seemed to think otherwise but after watching the Vancouver game earlier this week this ref seemed amazing.
There are always little calls that are outrageous
and will show up in the gamethread. Like Sean Johnson rolling the ball a yard over the line and not getting the corner called. But if you look back at the body of work it was very good.
Nos Audietis
by sidereal on Apr 9, 2011 4:43 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
from my vantage
It looked like the ball was always in contact with the line. Of course I could be wrong, but I can’t hold it against ref. However, what was Riley’s yellow about?!? Seemed severe for the way the game was being called.
Replay showed it was always on the line.
But, the way his body was sprawled out behind the endline and how he pulled it towards himself out of bounds, on first look it did look like it was a corner.
Agreed
You have to give credit to the ref, he did an excellent job.
H elooked to be
having a good time too.
Scoreboards, not billboards.
Regular season, not pre-season.
Our biggest offensive asset
Has got to be our versatility. Our attacking corps were all over the place and switching out positions. I loved it. It is hard to pull off successfully, thus making it very difficult to defend. Rosales played out on the wing and up top, as did Zakuani. Friberg also pushed up very high. I was very impressed and if we throw Fredy back out there, our offense has some serious firepower.
Regarding the Ref...
I reacted negatively in the gamethread to one of the ‘dives,’ but soon after I typed “you’re kidding me” in all caps I sort of regretted it. First, it wasn’t truly a dive. There was some contact and in that situation the ref looks to see what the player wants to do. If he had kept playing, the ref would have given him an advantage. The player decided he’d rather have the ball, so he went down. Sometimes it looks like a player is trying to trick the ref, but the ref wasn’t tricked. He was just waiting to see what the player wanted to do.
Its been a while since I’ve played and reffed, and I think at least for myself I need to stop being so reactionary when a player goes down. It isn’t always foul play.
Yeah but...
The Fire players sure spent a lot of time on the ground during this game. It seemed like Niyarko and #99 (whoever that was) would fall down every they lost control of the ball while they were in contact with a Sounder. I was very impressed with the ref not falling for all of these dives.
During the first half Niyarko was playing right in front of us and I was yelling “Fall down Niyarko, Fall down!” after a few of his dives. I’m pretty sure he could hear me and he didn’t like it. :)
by K61 on Apr 9, 2011 5:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Watching the game on television with replays
I thought the ref was very average. Have I seen worse, yes. But, to say he was good is an overstatement. He was inconsistent with his calls.
This was not a hard match to ref. The Sounders and most of the Fire are finesse players that don’t dive. But, there are a few like Nyarko.
There were a couple a calls like a Sounders clearance that went off a Fire player and the ref missed it, even though with the deflection the ball took a huge change of direction. That almost lead to a Chicago goal.
There was a Chicago player dive that got called on Gonzalez that lead to a Chcago free kick. A minute later, I think it was
Evans who got hammered at the edge of the box with no call. Replays backed up that both were missed calls.
There were more, but you get the idea. The ref was totally average, which is normal for MLS. If he looked good at all was because of the style the two teams play.
Yeah, at least from seeing it in person...
…the ref seemed average. Not terrible or anything, but not a performance that deserved all that much praise. Of course, I would definitely rather have more average ref performances if it meant throwing out the worst ref performances.
very poor reffing all game long. You can’t ignore blatantly obvious fouls in big time situations during the game. You just can’t. And he did, time and time again.
I assume you mean against the Sounders
do you also think he ignored blatantly obvious fouls against the Fire?
Nos Audietis
Carrasco
Was he even playing as a holding midfielder? Perhaps I saw our formation wrong, but I thought we shifted to Friburg on the left, Zakuani up top, and then Carrasco on the right with Evans and Alonso still central. I thought it was an odd move with Fernandez on the bench if we were going to put in a different right midfielder.
-Ben R.
Also
Carrasco probably deserved a red card instead of a yellow on that challenge. At least that’s what it looked like from my seat in 119.
-Ben R.
by reesebw on Apr 9, 2011 4:58 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think the replay showed that as well.
He went in pretty high with his studs up.
it looked like a 4-3-2-1 type of shape to me from my seats...
narrow it up, stay compact, and hit on the counter if possible.
Jaqua the target man with Friberg and Zak playing off of him in the closing minutes of the match. Ozzie, Carrasco, and Evans in the band of 3.
Writer for SB Nation's Manchester United blog, 'The Busby Babe'
http://twitter.com/#!/Tui11BRoy3
"ROOOONEY!.... It defies description. How about spectacular?...How about superb?"
That's what I saw too.
Carrasco did tend to drift right, and got free on the run, but he definitely wasn’t out on the wing.
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Yeah, he wasn't on long
so it wasn’t clear where he was standing in every situation, but in general he was side by side with Alonso in the defensive midfield.
Nos Audietis
Rosales needs to be on the field
Its amazing how less dangerous we are when he is not on the field. Once he is 90 mins fit we are going to be deadly. Its a great problem to have that Rosales, Evans, Fernandez, and Friberg and only 2 positions. We have a very deep team in the midfield. I cant wait to see what the FO does during the summer transfer window. We got to be bringing in Hahnemann and another striker.
Totally agree about Rosales
What a great signing by the front office. Vision, passing, ball control, all superb. Friberg looked great again today… well, except the wide open shot he missed. Otherwise, great game by him.
by wyte_lightning on Apr 9, 2011 7:19 PM PDT up reply actions
On a side note
The Union just scored on the Red Bull to take a 1-0 lead. Bad pass by Tim Ream lead directly to an easy goal.
What of El Flaco
a DP that’s D’d to the B(ench)?! If he isn’t in the starting 11, don’t we owe it to him to find a trade partner? How do we justify the expense for a backup?
don't get me wrong....i dig 'im
but shouldn’t we be able to flip him for something of value? My thinking is it is a waste to keep a DP on the bench when he probably could bring back value and open up considerable cap space.
On another note, I love the energy when half our starters include friberg, ozzie, evans and mauro
Problem
is its 1 less person in the midfield. If evans gets hurt again and is out for a while friberg is being moved to CM then Rosales/Alvaro for the RW spot.
If Seattle got Alvaro on a free instead of a seattle playing a transfer fee he wouldn’t been a DP.
IF Alvaro wants his starting spot back he needs to play better than friberg and Rosales.
This is a good problem to have Competition creates better players.
Oh
another thing with open cup and CCL. Alvaro will get this starting time.
As is we have tons of cap space to spend
since we’re down a DP. Let’s let the front office get all that sorted out first.
Because I'm pretty sure...
…that, if he isn’t in the starting XI by the summer transfer window, he’ll be handing in a request. I know that, technically, we could refuse the request, but it’s really bad form to do so in the world of futbol.
i hope that is sarcasm
but for heaven shakes, any player with that sort of attitude will not get anyone very far in this sport.
If El Flaco isn’t playing good enough to start then why should Sigi start him? It would be no different then anyone where else he would play at.
the
“if i am not on the starting by such and such I want out” attitude.
If El flaco wants to start then he should work his ass off to show why he should start.
The issue is that he doesn't play, so how the hell do we know he's not good enough?
by Aaron Campeau on Apr 9, 2011 10:27 PM PDT up reply actions
isn't
it that he did not start nor actually been subbed in today’s be enough of a clue that he isn’t playing good enough. I don’t think he even makes the 18 once Montero is starting again. Unfortunately its looking like he is 3rd depth CM 3rd Depth RW right now.
Sigi would rather play evans then start Alvaro which is a serious flaw with any head coach that plays his favorites then start someone else that man end up being better for the team.
answer
“enough of a clue that he isn’t playing good enough.”
No, it isn’t. He was subbed out in the red bulls game when he was far from the least effective player on the field and seems to have been relegated to bench duty since due to Sigi’s comfort with Evans. Evans is a very serviceable player, is a more effective tackler than Fernandez, and has his late-runs in the box.
…but Saturday Evans was again off target on his passes at multiple places on the field. Very little of the dangerous play (imho) from the sounders came through the middle, but rather was initiated by Zakuani or Rosales finding space, Friberg pushing forward or decent OBW holdup play.
When a little more technical prowess is called for or the Sounders are having trouble holding possession, I’d much rather see Flaco, and I don’t think Sigi has earned the benefit of the doubt on the matter.
What would earn him the benefit of the doubt in your opinion?
Myself, Championships is the answer and he has those. How many do you have?
a world without criticism
is very boring.
World class professionals make mistakes.
LeToux
Nyassi in game 2 vs. LA
substitution patterns of Levesque, Vagenas
Do you find none of these the least bid meritorious of a critical eye?
My championships argument trumps your I don't like the way he substitutes, etc
I don’t agree with of Sigi and the FO decisions. But, he has earned the right to make his decisions. When the Sounders go through a time like the Mariners, Seahawks and even Sonics before they left, then you can say he has not earned any benefit of doubt.
I am sure that Sigi doesn’t make every decision in a bubble. The players on the team are made in consultation with Hanauer, Henderson, Schmetzer, etc. The subs during the game are made with input from Schmetzer and Hendrickson. Ultimately, it is Sigi’s decision though.
In the end, you can criticize away, but don’t tell me that he hasn’t earned the benefit of the doubt, because he has.
perhaps your problem is the term
Because I was using “benefit of the doubt” to address the question as to whether one should trust Sigi’s judgment without question on the matter of Fernandez vs. Evans.
He has not earned that, he never could (since long term success is not an indicator of perfect judgment) and he has in fact demonstrated in the past a tendency to stick qith known quantities and recently successful systems (i.e. there is every reason to question his judgment on this specific topic). If you’d like to use a different phrase for that I’d be happy to reword… and I certainly never questioned Sigi’s “right” to the decision.
Above, the quote I responded to:
“isn’t it that he did not start nor actually been subbed in today’s be enough of a clue that he isn’t playing good enough.”
My response: No.
by nimajneb on Apr 10, 2011 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
This is an appeal to authority fallacy.
You use it constantly. It doesn’t do your argument any favors.
by Aaron Campeau on Apr 10, 2011 4:49 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
Our reputation for future DPs
I’m frustrated by the El Flaco situation. He just hasn’t been given a chance to see consistent minutes and prove himself. Should we be worried that he will soon be disgruntled and we will have burned through three DPs in less than 12 months? I know that all three situations were/are completely different, but it seems like this could affect a future big name signings willingness to join the Sounders as a DP.
by Sounder Abroad on Apr 9, 2011 9:48 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't think so.
It all comes down to money.
Why
someone with the DP tag be any different then anyone else? To me he’s just another player like everyone else and will be treated likewise.
A DP should be considered different because....
they’re a DP! You only get three of them. They better be special, and they better be starters. Not sitting on the bench or playing in reserve matches. You can say all you want that Fernandez is a DP only because of his transfer fee, but the fact remains that he’s still a DP. Sounders FO thought highly enough of him to pay the transfer fee and thus give him the DP tag, so no matter what sort of depth it gives you, having Fernandez sit on the bench is a total waste. We have plenty of non-DP 40-100k players that are subs/reserves.
Personally, I like Fernandez. He’s a plus to this team and this team is better off with him playing. But no matter how you view him, this is a FO fail. If he’s not good enough to start/play then really, what’s that say about our FO/scouting? And if he is good enough to start/play but isn’t starting/playing, then what’s that say about our coach? There is a major disconnect there. And as a result we have a reserve player taking up a DP slot.
by SoundersRiot on Apr 10, 2011 10:51 AM PDT up reply actions
okay
then if Fernandez should be playing who be on the bench and who to not be on the 18.
My point wasn't
that Fernandez the person should or shouldn’t be playing (although, yes I do prefer him to play). My point was that a DP SHOULD be playing. And if he’s not, then there’s a problem.
by SoundersRiot on Apr 10, 2011 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions
It would be different...
If having Alvaro on the roster as a reserve was keeping us from acquiring another DP quality player. That’s not the case. As it sits right now, the Sounders can afford to have a player like Flaco on the bench. I still think Flaco can develop into a very good player and one that will earn his keep on this team. I’m frustrated by him being on the bench, but I’m willing to give this some time.
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter
by Jeremiah Oshan on Apr 10, 2011 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions
I think Fernandez
is a very good player right now and only going to get better. But not if he’s not playing. Hopefully things work out to where he does see some significant minutes.
But isn’t it a problem that we’re even having this discussion? He’s one of our DPs. DPs are supposed to be our star players. Not our subs, not our reserve league players. We shouldn’t even be having to ponder this. If he wasn’t a DP, then great. But he is. And even though his spot isn’t stopping us from signing another right now isn’t really the point. If Nkufo was still here would your view be different? What about after we’ve sign another during the summer transfer?
by SoundersRiot on Apr 10, 2011 11:46 AM PDT up reply actions
of course things would be different if things were different
context matters
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
Prove it
"But who would listen to Little old me anyway?"
-by thehemogoblin
by Little old me on Apr 10, 2011 7:55 PM PDT up reply actions
I think you're way too caught up in the label
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter
by Jeremiah Oshan on Apr 10, 2011 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions
The label is important
Since there is a salary cap, then the only way to get established world class players is with the DP spot. If it were to be true that Fernandez is not good enough to start, then it’s being used on the wrong guy. I don’t think this is true, however. Sigi may have seen a lack of effort and is sitting him until he puts in the work. We don’t know this because everything is always a guess with the Sounders. This also could be a refusal by the coach to put Fernandez in the middle because of Evans. Again, maybe Evans has put in a better work rate. The main thing is that this is most likely a temporary thing that will work itself out. The Uraguayan national team thought highly enough last year to start him in a knockout game against Guana. I think he finds his way in our lineup soon.
Established World Class Players
don’t want to be a DP in the MLS unless they are past their prime. We don’t need more retreads.
Not what I meant
When I say established, I don’t mean superstars. I mean guys with possibilities of going to Europe and are not quite ready. Guys who are playing in good top flight leagues, or guys on the tail end of their career, that still have enough ability and experience to make a diffierence. A guy like Rosales could fall into that category, if we had of tried to aquire him directly from River Plate. Fernandez and Montero also fall into the category on the other end. DP money is a way to bring a player that would otherwise not come here and it should be used on difference makers, which I think Fernandez will be.
IMO, you and (mostly) SoundersRiot are off base in this discussion
SR says there is a problem with the Sounders FO and scouting. Since when did scouting become an exact science? If this team had been awful the last two years, then you two might have a point. But, it has been the most successful expansion team in history (don’t give me Chicago in year 2). That does not scream problem to me.
Regarding DP, several teams have signed DP’s that have been mediocre or worse. It just is not a Seattle problem. If having Fernandez were keeping Seattle from going out and signing another player, then SR might have a point. But, we all know that isn’t the case. Seattle is actively scouting for players that can come in during the summer transfer window.
SR, you write as if the contracts are guaranteed like they are in baseball or basketball and that contracts hurt a team for years. In MLS, that is not the case, mistakes can be corrected with little to no longterm affects.
Besides, Fernandez still has time to earn his starting job back. Seattle has only played 5 matches and there are 29 more not to mention the two other competitions Seattle is involved. For all we know, the reason that Fernandez is not playing could be the same as what occurred with N’Kufo. Sigi wanted him to play one way and Fernandez wasn’t.
How did I get in the off base category, when I agree with you
DP’s only hurt you more than any other player if he is not allowing for other signings. They are a great way to add top level talent and therefore are very important.
I'm (mostly) off base?
Please explain. It seems as if you might have misunderstood what my point was.
by SoundersRiot on Apr 11, 2011 5:03 AM PDT up reply actions
The ref
I was willing to give “Hey, maybe he wasn’t that bad,” a bit of thought after reading this.
Then I watched the game on DVR. He was horrible. Repeated simulation by Chicago, where the best we could hope for was him ignoring it (although key moment at the end, he gives a free kick on the edge of the box to Chicago after the guy looked like he got shot because Leo was near him). Multiple instances of blatant fouls, clear as day, in key situations that just went ignored (Evans on the edge of the box in the second half, getting studs to his foot, with ref looking at it from maybe 10 yards away, as one example).
And yes, Carrasco should’ve definitely seen red. Although I will say this: Chicago’s repeated diving (which, again, if the ref saw it this way, should’ve gotten them at least a booking at some point) may have at least caused a little bit of doubt for the red.
MLS refs
rarely call diving as it is. When they do it tends to be questionable rather it was an actually dive or not.
The best you can hope for from a ref
when a team is going down that easily (and it really wasn’t the team so much as Chaves himself) is to ignore it. Cards for simulation are rare and only for the most blatant attempts (no contact, deep in the box). Which is why Leo’s yellow for simulation was so ridiculous.
I haven’t seen the Carrasco tackle on replay yet, but I was standing near it and live it didn’t look malicious. He’s quickly building a reputation, though.
Nos Audietis
It may be sad but I think it was one of the best ref performances the MLS has had yet this year
The ref we had today made some mistakes, but overall I didn’t feel like he was very influential on the game with bad calls. There have been some atrocious performances by refs so far this year that have really impacted games (Van-NE this week). He actually did a pretty good job of not falling for the Fire players flops. Considering almost anytime one of them had the ball they were on the ground.
I have to disagree there
This was not a hard game to ref. He made some good calls, but he really did miss on several easy calls. He was very inconsistent. Just like Mistuhp said upon watching the relplay and I wrote in the live blog, the reg was not good. IMO, that you think he did a good job was because 85% of the players are fair players, meaning he mostly had a easy job. But, Chicago had 3 players that dove at the drop of a hat and the ref fell for it several times.
Like Rosales?
If you think he had a bad game, I’d like you to point out an MLS game that you thought was well officiated.
Nos Audietis
If your point is that no MLS official ever has a good game
then you’re sort of unqualified to have a conversation about whether a particular game was well officiated or not. Your opinion is permanently noted.
Nos Audietis
I'm not by any means saying he was amazing
but from watching a large majority of the games so far this season the ref during this game did an above average job at very least. Could he have been better? Absolutely. Did he have a major negative impact on the game? Not significantly. Refs are all going to make mistakes, even on easy calls, especially in MLS.
Overall with the ridiculous amount of times the entire Chicago team dived I think he did a pretty good job of allowing things to play on.
you are telling me
i was thinking this was going to be a bad soccer year for us…villa and sounders supporters that is. (well i guess the sounders were only 4 games in, but still…)
A sky of blue, a sea of green...(or claret)
Know what I saw that I haven't in awhile?
Zak’s wheels. Had a chance to talk with a fellow Sounder from Tacoma while watching the SJ match, and we both noticed how Zak wasn’t the green blur he usually is. If his wheels are back, and judging by the Fire players left choking on his dust, they are, there will be plenty more of the same coming.
I thought OBW was very good in the first half and in the second half really played a lot worse
He wasn’t winning anything, couldn’t hold any of the balls kicked up to him, and was one of the reasons we were getting pressed so hard in the 2nd half as compared to the first. it all made sense when I read Sigi’s quotes postgame:
I thought he played well. He took a pretty good knock in the ankle and that really started to bother him in the second half. That was one of the reasons we had to change him, and he wasn’t as effective in the second half because of that. I thought he had a very, very good first 45 minutes.
Hope it’s not serious, because that header was amazing – not only his power and placement of it, but the fact that he got it practically sandwiched between 2 defenders.
The ball that released Zakuani for the second goal was also pretty good
maybe not quite amazing.
You could see him motion to the bench a couple of times in the second half that he needed a sub.
Nos Audietis
Just a suggestion.
I don’t think we need to speculate on how our players (whether they are DPs or not) feel about their playing time and I definitely don’t think we need to start predicting what they are going to do about it unless it is working their asses off and being good teammates. Only 11 can play at a time. We have more than 11 good players. I’m sure they know how to deal with it.
This exactly.
Truth is…its WAY better to have TOO MANY good players than the starting XI than having too few and having to fill it up with non-starting quality.
Being able and having to select from a larger than XI group of fine quality, sounder starting quality players is certainly not bad situation to be in.
by SounderEvertonRomaFan on Apr 9, 2011 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Friberg has been my favorite addition to the team.
But he needs to finish. It seems like every game he’s given an empty net look on goal and he’s yet to put one away. Aside from that, he wins possession, has great speed, places his passes in the right spots, and places corners into dangerous areas. I just hope his finishing issues don’t become a real issue.
I would rather try fernandez in his spot in the midfield. I don’t see Friberg having the proper mental makeup for this team. This will be an issue all season long.
White Montero
Zakuani Alonso Fernandez Rosales
gonzales Hurtado Parke Riley ?
I would like to see us pick up another strong defender in place of Riley – I don’t know if anyone else on the roster is a potential starter here. This lineup allows for a ball control / attacking style on the right side, and a quick strike attack / long ball style on the left side. Alonso, Gonzales, and Hurtado will shore up the defensive deficiencies of Zakuani.
OK, I have to ask
What do you see about Friberg that you think he does not have the proper makeup?
Also, no one else on the roster is better than Riley at RB. There is no one even close.
by Coug1990 on Apr 10, 2011 8:37 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
prediction: Zakuani will allow more goals by his brainless and effortless focus on defense than he will ever score.
Zigi has got to be frustrated with Zakuani. His defensive focus is atrocious. He makes runs about 3 times a game, and he turns the ball over in the worst situations. Sure he is one of our most talented players, but there comes a time when focus and effort is more important than talent. Someones got to get on his arse – he is too good to play like this.
Not too worries about what Zigi thinks… But if our coach Sigi gets frustrated we may have an issue…
Sigi has other players to be concerned with that keep turning the ball over: Evans is the most obvious.
by chinsmd on Apr 10, 2011 8:45 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I can assure you
Sigi is not particularly concerned about Zak’s defense, which he’s not really asked to play much of. In games where he’s asked to track back, like against the Earthquakes, he does just fine.
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter
by Jeremiah Oshan on Apr 10, 2011 9:04 AM PDT up reply actions
I'm sick of these damn strikers never playing defense either
These POS keepers better hustle on offense too more.
by joesz on Apr 10, 2011 11:31 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
it is one thing to not play defense. It is another to give the ball away when your defense is not expecting it. Maybe the attitude of wingers and strikers not having to play defense is the exact reason why our team defense sucks right now. Beckham and Donovan sure play defense when needed… are our guys better than them?
The team defense sucks right now?
What indications are there of that?
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
I don't necessarily agree with handofgod
but you do have to admit that the team D was pretty shaky vs SJ and the second half vs Chicago was quite poor as well.
Second half of both of those games true
But should we ignore the solid defense in the first three matches of the year?
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
No, definitely not
but the bad D in the other halves also shouldn’t be glossed over.
In 10 halves Seattle has had poor D in 2
this team is not having defensive issues
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
I disagree
I think their problems can be fixed (i.e. I don’t think Parke or JKH or Ianni suddenly became bad defenders or anything), but IMO having multiple significant defensive lapses in 50% of the two most recent games counts as defensive issues in my book. Also, think of things like Riley’s giveaway that should by all rights have been a goal vs LA in game 1.
Mistakes like Riley's are not "issues" defensively
at least in my mind. It was a mistake, not a part of a broader series of problems.
Seattle is weak defending the counter this year. That’s the only defensive issue that is coming up regularly, but infrequently.
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
Perhaps it's a cop-out, but I'd say it comes down to a lack of focus
Not picking up a guy like Juninho, who we absolutely know can score from where he scored from, not running with Dawkins from SJ last week, losing Chavez’s run just after scoring, letting Pappa squirm through a couple of defenders to get an almost-goal before the ball was cleared… Those to me are all preventable goals where guys just didn’t do what was required of them. Sure, no defender is perfect, but the number of excellent chances the Fire had in a 10 minute or so span in the 2nd half was very unsettling and I think it was a repeat of some of last week’s bad defending and it’s beginning to be a pattern.
We’ll probably leak a few goals on set-pieces this season, like we have in the past, and also probably on the counter. i can live with those. Mostly those seem to be to be either due to tactical choices (which hopefully give us a better chance to score) or personnel. It’s the boneheaded errors that I think need to get shored up. If Keller has to make 3 spectacular saves to keep us in it every other week, we’re in trouble.
But this is the only week where Keller has been the defensive savior
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
That's because even he couldn't manage it previously
I’m not sure he’s let in one goal he had any significant chance of stopping so far this season. Maybe Agudelo’s, but that would have been a lot to ask.
After rewatching the game tonight, though, I felt a lot better about our defense. I think the necessary clean-ups are (hopefully) fairly minor. Watching it again, I think there really is only about a 10-min stretch that went poorly for the defense and most of that was based on losing possession in bad areas (or set pieces, which I’ve given up hoping we’ll defend well, at least this season).
not sure, maybe he just seems less calm and measured than the rest of the team. And he is missing a “toughness” intangible. Who knows, though. Maybe he grows into the role.
What role
would you llike him to grow into exactly? Just wondering
ZackyRy
by Zack Ryland on Apr 10, 2011 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions
I guess as more of a field general – organizing the offense with confidence and playing tough and dictating style of play on the other team.
You don't think he defines the style of play and forces defensive responses?
There are few in the league as good as he with the ball at his feet. He routinely gets double or triple teamed. Last year that meant that he merely 11 goals and 9 assists last year
I am not a Supporter | I am not a Fan | I am a Sounder
Sounder At Heart
I'm missing what you think he lacks
He’s easily the Sounders’ most dynamic offensive player. He’s the guy teams have to gameplan. Could he do more on defense? Maybe. But if it hurts his ability to perform on offense, I don’t want that trade off. Of all the areas that Sounders might need improvement, LW is probably 11th on the list.
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter
by Jeremiah Oshan on Apr 10, 2011 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions
I was talking about Friberg. sorry. maybe i replied on the wrong thread. I totally agree about Zakuani the guy is an absolute danger anytime he has the ball and is perfect for this team – just get on his butt about the little things.
Yeah, your reply is about 20 comments off from being in teh right thread
You may want to use a subject every now and then to clarify.
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter
by Jeremiah Oshan on Apr 10, 2011 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions
How is Tetteh coming along?
Will he be able to slot in for Gonzalez when he gets suspended for yellow card accumulation? That should be in what, 3 more games?
-Ben R.
Gonzales
Is going to lose us a game sometime this year. He was getting absolutely worked yesterday.
it was rather funny...
that when Nyarko and Pappa switched sides, Nyarko went ahead and embarrassed Riley a couple times in short succession and overall put in a significantly poorer performance (including a dangerously poor clearance in the penalty area).
…and Riley’s difficulty wasn’t a direct consequence of a bad giveaway in the defensive third.
A thought on the DP and the Sounders FC FO
The goal of the FO is to put together an entertaining and competitive football team that competes for trophies and particularly for the MLS Cup. They must accomplish this feat in a league which strives for parity.
The DP slots are simply one tool that can be used. I’m personally thrilled the FO has been able to add the services of Friberg and Rosales without using a DP slot. The Sounders FO has been creative and flexible in how this team has been assembled. Creative international scouting (Montaro, Friberg, Rosales, Gonzales, Hurtado, Fernandez), solid work in the initial expansion draft (Jacqua, Riley, Evans, Marshall) , good building through the rookie draft (Zakuani, Carrasco, Fucito), promotion and development of the USL Sounders (Levesque, Letoux, Nyassi), securing wily veterans (Keller, Ljundberg, Nkufo) and they have also added through trades (OBW). All this while building for the future not just the present. Most of this team is young and growing.
Each year has seen marked improvement in the team’s depth and skill while also moving toward more youth. No mean feat. Fernandez was available last summer at the cost of a DP size transfer fee. He brings quality to the depth of the team. Friberg and Rosales have been added in the interim and add to the mix without needing to spend the additional money. DP is just a means to an end. The end is to assemble the best product the team can field within the rules of the league. Fernandez is a player who can grow with this team. He will get playing time as the season progresses. The Sounders still have a DP slot available, if they want to use it. They are losing nothing by having one DP occupied by Fernandez as a developmental player. Being able to see beyond the shallow idea that all DP slots must be used for superstar starters is precisely the creative flexibility that a sports franchise FO needs in order to thrive within the context of a league designed to create parity. The Sounders FC FO has and will continue to make some mistakes. They don’t own a crystal ball. But they deserve the full measure of credit for the work that they have done in a very short period of time. This is a quality organization that has been built well from the outset. If you need a reminder of what happens when a team is not built well, all you need to do is look at the sorrier elements of the Mariner’s sordid history.
by Abbott Smith on Apr 10, 2011 9:55 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I like you
but you’re clearly way too level-headed for us here.
Nos audietis in somniis
Nos audietis in altum
by Seattle Coug on Apr 11, 2011 3:56 PM PDT up reply actions
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