US Forward Eddie Johnson joining MLS via allocation
Chivas still has top spot in the order, but passed on Feilhaber and Adu. Seattle is 6th and would likely have to trade up to get him. But he is a forward...
9 months ago
sidereal
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This may be a really stupid question
But is the whole allocation thing for USMNT players for USA-based MLS teams only? In other words, are Toronto and Vancouver in the the allocation order for USMNT players, or do they have their own allocation order with CMNT players?
Canada
teams are also in allocarion for USMNT players.
It's all MLS
Here’s the order and explanation.
You will hear us on Brougham, you will hear us on Occidental, you will hear us on King. Our yachts are all around you, there is no escape.
BTW
There are no stupid questions when it comes to MLS rules. Even those that know a hell of a lot (not me) are often at a loss.
You will hear us on Brougham, you will hear us on Occidental, you will hear us on King. Our yachts are all around you, there is no escape.
This does not sound complicated at all
From wikipedia:
Major League Soccer employs no fewer than 12 methods to acquire players. These include: signing players on transfers/free transfers as is done in most of the world; via trades; drafting players through mechanisms such as the MLS SuperDraft, MLS Supplemental Draft, or MLS Re-Entry Draft; rarely used methods which cover extreme hardship and injury replacement; signing players as Designated Players or Homegrown Players; placing a discovery claim on players; waivers; and methods peculiar to MLS such as through allocation or a weighted lottery.
Strange
that list doesn’t include the magic fairy dust DP waiver used by the Galaxy.
You will hear us on Brougham, you will hear us on Occidental, you will hear us on King. Our yachts are all around you, there is no escape.
If LA
can’t trade JPA then they aren’t getting Keave.
plus
Keave isn’t active on LA’s Roster yet.
How sweet would it be
If the rest of the league blocked LA from acquiring Keane by refusing to take JPA? Then Keane’s “dream” wouldn’t come true.
That was my first thought when I heard about the need to drop JPA
But I’m sure at the very least LA has someway to let go of JPA at a cost if no one wants him. And the league is bound to see Keane as a valuable player to the league and would bend the rules for him.
They
can force a team to trade for JPA regardless if they like it or not. Remember the whole Mcbride case.
I am curious though
what does happen when a CMNT player reenters the league? Probably nothing I would guess.
No
Everyone yawns, then nothing. ;)
You will hear us on Brougham, you will hear us on Occidental, you will hear us on King. Our yachts are all around you, there is no escape.
Country Music NeTwork right?
You will hear us on Brougham, you will hear us on Occidental, you will hear us on King. Our yachts are all around you, there is no escape.
Eddie Johnson > Noonan
For the right price I vote trade up.
at
the cost of missing out on landing marcus which we do need a keeper.
Allocation
Restarts at the end of the year based on position, so if we end up with the 4th or 5th best record, we then have the 4th or 5th worst allocation spot next year.
I'd sign him if none of the teams above us did
Otherwise I’d pass.
i may
chance it if Marcus doesn’t try signing with MLS until the 2012 season then trade with Montreal to get Marcus.
Wont Marcus be 40 by then.
Would we really want to sign another 40 year old keeper?
He's
better than who we have at 2nd and 3rd string.
I guess I also
want to know what kind of money Johnson wants. If he wants Jaqua kind of money maybe, more than that though and we’d be looking at losing too much cap flexibility for next season I would think.
Well
Keller is retiring that would open 250k but that’s probably gonna be going to our next keeper rather it be marcus or someone else.
I just dont see..
the need to spend 250K on a keeper. There are great keepers in this league who make much less than that. And some worse keepers that make alot more (cough.. cough…Rost).
They are hard to find though.
we did
for Keller for the first 2 season. Going cheap on GK is not the solution.
It's the solution for Hall, Saunders, Busch, Johnson, Kennedy, Frei, ...
It’s rare to spend a ton of money on a keeper
Nos Audietis
Keller earned his money by doing a lot more then just being between the posts
Team captain, US legend, local icon.
He was incredibly valuable for the team early on.
I just don't see them
signing Marcus now and them putting him on the roster (why would we have 4 keepers on the roster). I think there’s a chance of it happening, but wouldn’t it already happened if it was? The allocation order resets at the end of the season anyways, so they might as well use it now if it makes sense.
then
boss goes bye bye. I would agree if Marcus isn’t planning to return until the 2012 season. However that’s the question when will marcus sign with MLS.
Well he's got under
a month to do it if it’s gonna be this year.
EJ
Pro:
He’s a forward with a moderate history of success in MLS (41 goals in 127 matches).
Con:
In 80 matches since leaving MLS in 2008, he’s only struck 7 goals.
As a Returning USMNT Team Player! he’s likely to be overvalued.
He’s 27 (older than I thought), putting him on the wrong side of prime territory for offensive players.
My humble conclusion, while he’s probably an improvement over our current stable of forwards, he’s not worth the likely cost to trade up. In the unlikely event he drops to the Sounders, I’d think about taking him, with much being dependent on the Keller replacement strategy (I’m not convinced it involves Hahnemann, but that’s just me).
You will hear us on Brougham, you will hear us on Occidental, you will hear us on King. Our yachts are all around you, there is no escape.
Sign EJ...
If Kingson is the replacement keeper
I'd sign him if he drops
And doesn’t want DP money. He’s a big upgrade from what we currently have, but I don’t want him to prevent the Soumders from making a bigger signing in the off-season.
He's not the help we deserve, but he's the help we need right now.
So if he falls to us we’ll take him because we can. Because he’s not the best. He’s a scoring player, a national team player. A target forward.
by agtk on Aug 16, 2011 1:01 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
This is potentially good for us ...
It brings to light many possibilities …
a) a team ahead of us takes him, leaving one less team ahead of us for Marcus. In addition,
- Chivas has already passed on Fielhaber and Adu and is rumored to be signing JPA…no way they still have resources or will for this
- of Houston, Toronto, Chicago and Sporting KC, only Chicago seems likely to have use for a guy up front like EJ. IF one of the other 3 took him, perhaps we could take some of their depth off of their hands.
b) he falls to us … we sign him as a higher salary non-dp player.
Worst case, he falls to us but asks too much money or DP status…so we pass. No harm.
As a side-note …if Montreal really likes Montaño, perhaps a trade for their #1 allocation spot is in the works??
Someone needs to explain the Hahnemann love
He’s going to be 40 and in serious decline.
We were spoiled by Kasey—Marcus is not and was never the same caliber of keeper.
I would prefer watching Ford or Meredith grow
by ClosetCoug on Aug 16, 2011 1:07 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
they are both a couple of years away...but with great potential
Marcus would be perfect…allowing them to develop while giving us experience between the pipes. BTW…Hahnemann is still considered a solid keeper in England. He would easily start in the Championship and is still a quality EPL backup for whoever needs one. He will have choices.
Perfect he can choose someone else!
Kasey was a special case. Competent goal keepers are a dime a dozen, I don’t want to dole out a big contract to a 40 year old EPL backup
EPL
back up is better than who we have now for back up.
Good thing he's not the only other keeper in the world!
by ClosetCoug on Aug 16, 2011 1:16 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
Just curious
Have you watched MH play in EPL?
by Randy Meeker on Aug 16, 2011 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions
We can...
agree to disagree. I think that, while not quite at Keller’s level, Hahnemann is far beyond just competent. And yes…I have watched him dozens of times both with Reading and Wolves…and I’ve played keeper all my life…so I’m just bandwagoning. With that said, I would agree with the sentiment that, after a point, the rule of diminishing returns holds more true with Keepers and defenders than other positions.
That's fair
I just want people to ditch the false dichotomy. It isn’t Boss or Hahnemann. It is Boss and every other goal keeper available in the world—particularly ones who dont need to go through allocation.
by ClosetCoug on Aug 16, 2011 1:20 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
..if we need a local guy..
it’s too bad we can’t get Tally Hall. He’s young and really coming into his own.
There was a point a couple of years ago...
when 4 of 20 EPL starters were American and 2, 10%!, were from WA. We produce great keepers.
Hope
Anyone else want to really break boundaries and see the Sounders give Solo a shot?
by Abbott Smith on Aug 16, 2011 5:03 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I would so love that
She’s miles ahead of Boss. Her only down side is she’s a bit short at 5’9" and I’m not sure physically how well she’d do on a tightly packed box.
If
marcus wants to return to seattle and Seattle wants him the league will make it happen like they did with Mcbirde.
Totally agree..
I dont want to have to deal with this again 2 years from now
Depending on what happens down the line
2 years from now Meredith/Ford could really be coming into form. I think the general hope is to get someone experienced to help that process along and to save us from Boss until the younger keepers are ready.
Exactly
Marcus would be good for Meredith and Ford to learn from.
But Keller will probably still be here.
Just not playing.
We simply need to see the potential deal at the time
I think everything will depend on what it takes to get him if we have the opportunity. He is not a TF and its not clear how we could use him in our starting lineup. He be nice as an option off the bench though. Marcus is simply too old for us. We would be facing a keeper issue again within 2 years. We are better to go younger.
by Brougham Hooligan on Aug 16, 2011 1:09 PM PDT reply actions
then Medith
and ford would be ready for the starting job as Keeper. We need someone to bridge the gap.
I'd trade up to get him.
We have a very good team right now, but I don’t think it’s good enough to win either the MLS cup or the Supporter’s Shield. We’re really close though, and he’s an obvious improvement over our current options at forward.
i'd wait to see how far he fell
plus I dont think he’s worth a DP contract. If he was non-dp, I’d say its an obvious improvement.
It's too bad we can't convince Keller to stay 2 more years
Then we could easily make a go for EJ and have a great keeper to help train Ford/Meredith.
Anyone know what Keller is planning after his retirement?
He's hinted that he'd like to be involved with the team
presumably in a coaching capacity. I think that’s very likely.
Another possibility is being involved with the national team somehow.
Nos Audietis
Allocation is reset at the end of the year right?
We shouldn’t be wasting a Roster spot on a 4th keeper this year so Marcus probably won’t sign until next year anyways…
"The fans are excited. And the stadium, well, it ignites with explosion."
If we get sign another keeper
now wouldn’t that mean one of other ones gets the boot?
I'm not sure they can boot
Boss what with guaranteed contracts for veteran players now. I don’t know the specifics though.
you do
bring a good point but does he qualify for Guaranteed contracts though?
Ok so they can't waive Boss
They could still transfer/loan him out if the need came up.
Is it known how long he has left on his contract?
If allocation is reset at the end of the year
Then we should certainly jump on it. We don’t need MH until after the season. Not like we need a 40 year old keeper with a 40 year old backup at the moment.
Wouldn't
veteran keeper with Veteran as 2nd string back up be better than Veteran keeper with boss as a 2nd string back up?
Not saying it’s going to happen but wouldn’t we have a much improvement there especially for CCL
Absolutely
I guess it’s a matter of lesser of two evils. I think having EJ instead of Levesque or Jaqua up top is better then having MH as backup to Keller instead of Boss
I don't
know if EJ would be helpful next season especially at the potential cost he will be against the cap.
Fair point
So it also is possibly a short term v long term argument. But Hahnemann’s future is still unknown. If it was certain he was coming to the US this year I’d be leaning to Hahnemann, but with it unknown I kinda like Johnson better. There’s also a lot of changes we could make in the offseason so I’m not too worried about cap hits (after all, we have a habit of paying bench players a lot).
question
do you see EJ as an replacement for montero if seattle sells him.
For Montero no
I don’t think EJ would be worth DP money. But I’d rather have him then Noonan/Jaqua/Levesque starting up top.
But if I see your point it’s that we’d be sitting on a lot of strikers next year that we might not want while still needing two starters up front. And if that’s what it turned into then I could see passing on EJ
MH is not part of the EJ equation
If Marcus planned on playing in MLS this season, he’d already be here. So our currently allocation spot probably isn’t worth being patient with. If the price for EJ is right, we should do it.
The Montano loan probably has a LOT to do with Hahnemann. The allocation order resets after the season, with Montreal moving to the top spot. The Impact’s interest in a returning USMNT player is almost certainly far lesser than than most MLS teams. Not to mention the MH might only want to play in Seattle. So we loan Montreal a player now, they agree not to take anyone from our roster in the expansion draft. Then in the offseason we trade Montano (or someone else if Montano doesn’t impress) to Montreal for Hahnemann.
by LordIceman on Aug 16, 2011 1:51 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Eddie Johnson
He finished last season with Preston with officially 0 goals and 2 assists in 17 starts and 30 appearances. The club was relegated from Championship to League 1. I’m not sure at this point that he’s even a better option than Pat Noonan. After all Pat Noonan used to score a lot in MLS too. We definitely shouldn’t even consider making him a DP. I don’t know if we can afford to pay him Jaqua/Noonan level of salary. Even if we did, do we really want a third forward in that category? I’m not even sure I want to trade anyone we have to have the opportunity to sign him.
There’s also no way that Boss is our starting GK next year. If we don’t get Hahnemann, we’ll find another veteran we can sign for a salary comparable to other MLS keepers. I’d be more than happy with a Jimmy Nielsen quality keeper. He makes about $140k, so I expect to pay a veteran keeper somewhere in that neighborhood.
He's much better than Noonan
He’s younger and doesn’t have the injury problems. He’ll still in his peak playing age. EJ has more USMNT caps, more USMNT goals and played in much better leagues. The MLS, when Noonan was successful, was a much less competitive league than today’s MLS.
EJ is no home run, but he’ll be an upgrade over Noonan.
by Dizzo on Aug 16, 2011 2:44 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Wasn't MLS less competitive when EJ was successful?
EJ’s last season in MLS: 2008
Noonan’s last successful season in MLS: 2007
Johnson had 14 goals and 5 assists in 2008 but never had more than 1 goal in any other season in MLS. He scored very rarely in the “less competitive” seasons of MLS when Noonan saw his most successful seasons. Now, he may be a better option than Noonan now, but I think the jury’s out on him being a much better option.
by Randy Meeker on Aug 16, 2011 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Noonan has also undergone a couple surgeries since then
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter. You'll Never Yacht Alone.
by Jeremiah Oshan on Aug 16, 2011 3:43 PM PDT up reply actions
If we have a chance to get EJ
We should take that chance. I don’t want us to sell the farm to get him but he would be an upgrade at FWD. I think he will probably be in the Kenny Cooper range 250-300k. If this is true then when Jaqua (200k) comes off the books next year, I don’t see this hampering our ability to sign players next year. I think that if Hahnemann was going to join the league this year he wouldve signed already. I have a feeling that when he met with Seattle they let him know that they want him but not until next season. I also think that he really wants to end his career in Seattle. This is all conjecture but I hope that we can get some help up top this year and a GK during the off season.
Where
is that 50-100k gonna come from? Rosales is gonna get a well needed raise then the Keeper situation we don’t know how much the new keeper will cost us. Its a gamble but Seattle willing to take on that gamble.
After not signing anyone
I could see Seattle taking a gamble that wouldn’t hurt our future DP prospects. But I do think 300k is too high (isn’t that just 50k below what you pay for a 3rd DP anyway?)
actually
35k below. With out knowing how much EJ is gonna cost us both now and long term (in terms of other players) its too big of a gamble i am comfortable with.
by gstommylee on Aug 16, 2011 3:01 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
If we can get him for the right price
then I think he could be a great asset this year and a solid backup next year (afterall, we will have USOC and hopefully CCL again and need all the players we can get).
I’m not too worried about moving players in the off season though.
Exactly
its all what the price is. If he’s has a jaqua like salary and performs better then we just dump Jaqua. I would agree that way it’s not costing seattle anything more in terms of cap space. Its just a matter of him making more than jaqua then we need to figure out where that additional money is gonna come from.
Don't forget that the cap gets raised next year
Plus Im sure some older players will not be resigned or at least to smaller deals, Graham, Noonan, and Gonzalez. I’m not too worried about the cap. We can make some moves in the off season to clear up space. If we sell Montero we will have a whole lot of allocation dollars to play around with. I still think we can go after a DP for next year.
by Colin Johnson on Aug 16, 2011 3:25 PM PDT up reply actions
True
but that open cap space by cutting those player may go towards needed upgrades on the back line like outside backs or CBs for example.
I would trade
Keeping our backline the same next year for a forward this year. I think we are just that one piece away from a double. I don’t think we can catch LA for the SS and I think we have the talent to win the USOC without upgrade but I don’t trust our forwards to help push us through the playoffs to win the MLS Cup.
by Colin Johnson on Aug 16, 2011 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions
But
we also have the CCL to deal with. And i doubt chivas would want Estrada or seamon though.
no I meant
I would rather have EJ this year and not change our backline next year than pass on EJ so we have cap space to improve our backline. I still think we go after Tagoe in the winter window if he stays at Hoffenheim whether we get EJ or not.
by Colin Johnson on Aug 16, 2011 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions
Instead of Hanemann
I’d love Neil Etheridge. Third string keeper for Fulham, will be 22 next year. I don’t know what Fulham would want for a year or two-long loan, but we could make him a young-ish DP, counting only $200k against the cap. Fulham might even like the deal as he would get plenty of starting time as he develops, while (hopefully) being taught by one of the best GKs in the world (Kasey).
The catch, of course, is that we’d tie up a valuable DP slot on GK, a position where there are plenty of other serviceable GKs out there for less money.
by agtk on Aug 16, 2011 3:14 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Currently I don't feel a keeper would be worth a DP slot
Especially if we can get someone like Tagoe and don’t end up losing Montero this off season. I don’t think Flaco has been quite strong enough to be picked up by Europe yet.
Strange
MLS just removed EJ article from their website.
He does have personal issues going on
maybe that caused something.
http://www.soccerbyives.net/soccer_by_ives/2011/08/johnson-involved-in-incident-with-wife.html
by Brougham Hooligan on Aug 16, 2011 3:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Would
MLS already know about that situation by now?
One would think
Lets hope its a technical thing or else MLS will have their own version of a Nkufo.(in SEA, Nkufo is a synonym to Snafu)
by Brougham Hooligan on Aug 16, 2011 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Or
someone jumped the gun on that there hasn’t been a contract signing with MLS yet?
Just checked, MLS did take the article down completely
All the other articles say he was “signed by MLS.”
by Brougham Hooligan on Aug 16, 2011 3:58 PM PDT reply actions
The Twiiterverse has just gone dead silent on this
Everyone is scrambling to find out whats going on
by Brougham Hooligan on Aug 16, 2011 4:03 PM PDT up reply actions
The SBN article now links from here
very weird about the MLS article.
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter. You'll Never Yacht Alone.
a tweet from the right source would quell this quickly
Nothing in almost an hour now. I need to start my drinking for tonights game already, and this is going to keep me glued to my Blackberry until there is an “all clear” with EJ.
by Brougham Hooligan on Aug 16, 2011 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions
here
the reason why it was pulled the deal wasn’t completed yet per ives. So someone running the site jumped the gun.
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