"We’re having some conversations about that," Sounders general manager Adrian Hanauer said today. "… We’ve had discussions about ways in which we might be able to partner together on our academy kids that go off to school."
Tacoma Tide could become Sounders-U23 | Sounders Insider - The News Tribune
It reads like the Sounders/Tide partnership would be an amatuer team, rather than a pro-PDL side like Kitsap. If it happens, and that seems increasingly likely that you'll get to see Academy Alumni in Rave Green again.
4 months ago
Dave Clark
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an amatuer pdl team is a great idea
This will allow us to keep developing players in college to our style of play. The players can cut their teeth in college and then return to the club to play in the summer. We can get a better look at how far along they are. Plus it will give us more opportunities to beat up on P*rtland.
Look for the Sounders U-23's
to be based in the Puyallup area. Washington Crossfire own playing rights to King County, so this will not be a Starfire club. http://goalwa.wordpress.com/2012/01/17/tacoma-tide-sounders-in-talks-to-affiliate-in-pdl/
That's a shame
Starfire would be an ideal location for an U-23 club especially if the Sounders ever decide to expand seating capacity on the far side of the main pitch.
PDL averages a couple hundred fans
Starfire is probably too big already.
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Timbers got 1,600
Per match in 2011, including a School Day event that drew over 4k. I would think the Sounders U-23’s could outdraw the academy at least.
The 4k event created a misleading mean
They only played 3 home matches at Jeld-Wen: Sat. 5/7 vs Victoria (223 attendance), Wed. 5/25 vs. North Sound (2762), and Fri. 6/3 vs. Kitsap (4754). The rest of their home matches were played at various other stadiums, with attendance ranging from 300 to 790. The median attendance would fall below 1000.
I know the Kitsap match was a Groupon promotion (maybe the same for North Sound, but I’m not 100% sure on that), so it would be really tough to argue that it’s typical for them to pull thousands for U23 matches.
by Randy Meeker on Jan 17, 2012 9:19 PM PST up reply actions
Tacoma Tide's 2011 attendance
will surely be bested if this all comes to fruition, though. http://goalwa.wordpress.com/2011/08/09/final-regular-season-nw-pdl-attendance-numbers/
How do you own playing rights?
Who controls something like that? I know baseball has some special monopoly exception but I was unaware lower level soccer sets up monopolies as well.
USL sells "territory"
to its owners. The PDL Washington Crossfire own the King County territory for PDL. In the past they have been very protective of that, to the point of not allowing the Tide to move practices to Starfire when the Tacoma club had a mainly Seattle-based squad.
The Key
I hope something like this gets done. Very little money for a lot of reward.
The college kids that the Sounders want to be part of the “home grown talent” and “academy products” need to be protected. It is not like $1,500-$3,000 per month is going to stop players from going to college to get their training (plus eduction) anytime soon. Even when/if the money get better, players are still going to go to chose college.
The figure you reference there is for the lower division pro leagues
and has no relationship to an amatuer PDL team. Also, there is no requirement, nor currently incentive, for an MLS team to operate a PDL side. Richards was an exception, not the rule. Just by training a couple weeks a summer a possible HGP’s status is retained.
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There isn't supposed to be a direct incentive...
But further developing players who hope to potentially make HGPs someday is a benefit. Playing PDL is at least somewhat more beneficial than reserve league simply because there are reliable numbers of games and reserve league is not the most practical place to get academy kids minutes.
In a bigger picture, though, the PDL team is not supposed to allow the Sounders to bring players into the fold that wouldn’t otherwise be.
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter. You'll Never Yacht Alone.
by Jeremiah Oshan on Jan 17, 2012 8:37 AM PST up reply actions
College Academy Alumni can't play in the reserve league and maintain NCAA eligibility
As they’d be on the same team as paid players.
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That makes sense...
but how are academy kids able to play in the reserve league and maintain college eligibility?
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter. You'll Never Yacht Alone.
by Jeremiah Oshan on Jan 17, 2012 9:31 AM PST up reply actions
Accepting salary, expenses or prize money exceeding actual expenses
All players will need to meet with an NCAA eligibility center to verify they have maintained their amateur status.
I think it's NCAA magic that somehow doesn't apply prior to the scholarship
since in neither case is the player themselves actually getting paid.
NCAA magic explains a lot.
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NCAA Magic is also known as the NCAA Eligibility Center
Quoting the handbook:
If there are violations of NCAA amateurism rules, the NCAA Eligibility Center may certify you with conditions, which must be fulfilled before you are eligible for competition. The conditions will be set based on which rule was violated and the severity of the violation. Such conditions may include repayment of money or sitting out of competition for a specified number of games, or both. In some cases, the NCAA Eligibility Center may determine that the violations are such that permanent ineligibility for competition is the appropriate penalty.
The link above is just for the FAQ.
Here is the full website regarding eligibility and at the end of this month the website will no longer be viewable to unregistered NCAA members.
Because the rules may jeopardize amateur status and requires an NCAA review
College Academy Alumni don’t risk or have been advised not to risk their status to play in reserve games so they can stay with their college teams.
To be clear, though
It looks like the Tide would operate in the Sounders’ best interest, with players that had at least some inkling of a chance to advance (while remaining amateur.) When the head coach is announced, we will see the Sounders influence goes right to the top of the “new” U-23’s.
Incentive
I’d say the ability to get Academy alumni into competitive matches to get an idea of their readiness to compete at the MLS level prior to signing them as a HGP is a decent incentive. I agree that having a PDL team wouldn’t allow us to sign HGP’s that aren’t Academy alumni.
It seems that the league allowed an exception for Portland because they don’t have an Academy and are new to the league. I think they would make the same exception for us if there was a player that entered college before we established our academy, yet played for our U23 PDL club. If we had a U23 last year and Kelyn Rowe had played for us there, we probably would have been able to sign him as a HGP, so that would be a decent incentive, but there is a small window on the payoff of that particular incentive. By the time our inaugural class of Academy alumni use up their NCAA eligibility, the HGP signing incentive would no longer exist.
Regardless, I still think the benefits of being able to better evaluate Academy alumni in the summer are worth the operational costs, especially if they are shared to some degree with the current Tacoma Tide ownership group.
by Randy Meeker on Jan 17, 2012 9:34 PM PST up reply actions
Shared, not really
The Tacoma group has all of the expenses, but benefits from the use of the name “Sounders” and the hiring of a key Sounders employee as head coach. Other than that, and the possibility of “nesting” at SoundersFC.com, this will be an independently funded side.
I like to see pretty much anyone investing in the PDL
Next step: USL-Pro in the Mountain and Pacific time zones.
But there's LA....
I’m kidding. The absence of D2/D3 soccer West of the Mississippi is awful. Edmonton, San Antonio and LA is it. The “regional” brackets of the Open Cup are going involve more travel then they should for that level of club because only 2 of 16 US non-MLS pro clubs are in the same region as 9 US MLS teams
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It seems like the easiest way to make it happen is for a bunch of clubs to form simultaneously
Perhaps some PDL sides will be successful enough (gain enough fans/revenue/potential revenue) that at some point they can jump up to USL-Pro.
Tacoma Tide is a club we like. —@FakeAdrianH
"It's scintillating, it's sensational, it's Seattle Sounders FC soccer."
by LoiteringWithIntent on Jan 17, 2012 10:28 AM PST reply actions 2 recs
We've been tracking them all year
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Just how big of a deal would this be if it went through?
I’m a little fuzzy on how academy teams work in the US.
not that big of a deal, but still kinda cool
It basically means former Sounders academy players could go to places like Tacoma for PDL instead of Portland (just to use an example).
Editor/writer at Sounder at Heart, MLS editor SB Nation. Follow me on Twitter. You'll Never Yacht Alone.
by Jeremiah Oshan on Jan 17, 2012 5:47 PM PST up reply actions
Okay thanks.
So, players we’ve maybe gotten somewhat fond of could stay “close to home” so to speak.
Would this be an option for developing young players too (like Brian Meredith last season at Kitsap but more formal)?
It's a big deal for 4th division soccer
In the state of Washington, though. Certainly having a Sounders-related presence will bring more attention to the PDL NW Division. It’s good for the local game and for true neigborhood derbies to take hold.
by David Falk on Jan 18, 2012 5:58 AM PST reply actions 2 recs
Yes.
Wish I could rec: again.
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